MMasters in Business
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Louis Navellier11 July 2016

Interview With Louis Navellier: Masters in Business (Audio)

3Frameworks
12Insights

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Frameworks in this episode

Insights & moments

The myth-busts, hot takes, explainers, and tools worth keeping.

Myth Buster· 2

Myth Buster07:24

ETFs Are Not Free When Spreads and Discounts Widen

Navellier argues that an ETF's expense ratio does not capture the full cost of buying and selling it. Premiums, discounts, rebalancing costs, and flash-crash liquidity failures can make trading materially more expensive, so he regards ETFs as better suited to buy-and-hold use than frequent trading.

  • ETF entry and exit prices can diverge from net asset value.
  • Rebalancing and exchange spreads create costs beyond the stated expense ratio.
  • Flash crashes can leave the ETF trading while underlying stocks cannot be priced.
  • Navellier recommends buy-and-hold use rather than active ETF trading.

“the e t F world, you gotta be careful because et F s can have premiums to get in and discounts to get out”

Louis Navellier · 07:31

“I think ETFs are better for buy and hold investing than than trading.”

Louis Navellier · 17:53
#etfs#liquidity#trading costs#flash crashes
Myth Buster1:00:00

The Hidden Economics Behind “Free” Investment Products

Navellier and Ritholtz explain that products advertised with no transaction or management fee can still generate revenue through spreads, house inventory, securities lending, market making, internal expense ratios, and placement payments. The absence of an explicit charge does not mean the customer or product ecosystem bears no cost.

  • Bond dealers can earn through markups and wide bid-ask spreads.
  • Asset gatherers may earn from securities lending and affiliated market making.
  • Some robo-platform placements involve payments from ETF providers.
  • Internal expense ratios and trading relationships can replace visible commissions.

“There is no free lunch. Of course you're being charged. It's just not transparent or disclosed.”

Barry Ritholtz · 1:01:08

“the asset gatherers on Wall Street, which dominate our business, are a very good gathering assets, convincing where they have low fees.”

Louis Navellier · 1:01:25
#hidden fees#spreads#robo advisors#market making

Explainer· 4

Explainer10:43

How Index Baskets Can Make the Biggest Stocks Even Bigger

Navellier says capitalization-weighted indexes and shifts from equal-weighted ETFs can concentrate buying in already-large companies. He compares late-1990s technology concentration and the later dominance of Facebook, Amazon, Netflix, and Google with earlier episodes in which popular benchmark holdings became crowded.

  • Capitalization weighting directs more index money toward the largest stocks.
  • Moving from equal-weighted to cap-weighted ETFs can reinforce concentration.
  • Being added to a major basket can create substantial demand for a company.
  • Navellier warns against buying broad baskets when the market is unusually narrow.

“the big stocks are getting bigger because of the cap weighting the SMP.”

Louis Navellier · 10:43

“getting added to some of these baskets is the greatest thing that ever happens to some of these companies.”

Louis Navellier · 12:52
#indexing#market concentration#smart beta#bubbles
Explainer18:25

Why a Growing Mutual Fund Can Be More Tax-Efficient

Navellier explains that new assets entering a mutual fund can dilute the tax impact of realized gains across a larger asset base. Conversely, he says a shrinking fund can become a tax time bomb because fewer remaining investors bear the embedded taxable gains.

  • Fund accounting spreads taxable gains across the fund's asset base.
  • Rapid asset growth can dilute each investor's share of the tax burden.
  • Shrinking funds can concentrate embedded gains among remaining investors.
  • Navellier seeds new funds with his own taxable capital partly for this reason.

“When I see it a mutual fund, and then I run around grow it because people like me or whatever. Something happens. What happens is…”

Louis Navellier · 18:25

“when fund shrink, they become tax tigme bonds. When they grow their tax efficient”

Louis Navellier · 19:31
#mutual funds#tax efficiency#capital gains#fund flows
Explainer26:21

Why Foreign Negative Yields Can Pull Money into US Assets

Navellier argues that negative yields in Germany, Japan, and Switzerland encourage global money to move toward the United States while US rates remain higher, the currency remains relatively stable, and the economy remains adequate. He expects those flows to sustain a strong dollar and continue pressuring multinational and commodity-company profits.

  • International rate differences can redirect capital toward the United States.
  • Currency stability and economic conditions affect whether those flows persist.
  • A strong dollar can hurt US multinationals and commodity companies.
  • Navellier says global market forces can outweigh Federal Reserve intentions.

“with negative yields in Germany, Japan, Switzerland, money's gonna keep pouring the United States as long as we have higher rates in the rest of…”

Louis Navellier · 26:21

“our FED is not driving the bus.”

Louis Navellier · 26:47
#interest rates#capital flows#strong dollar#central banks
Explainer1:10:28

Why Navellier Separates Publishing from Asset Management

Navellier says securities rules prevent his firm from simply cloning a newsletter into a managed product because the newsletter is not approved management marketing material. His publishing and management operations therefore use separate locations, names, and managers even though their research may overlap.

  • A newsletter portfolio cannot simply be cloned into managed accounts.
  • Newsletter material is not treated as permitted management marketing material.
  • Publishing and management operate from different headquarters.
  • Related strategies may overlap without matching exactly.

“The SEC will never let us clone a newsletter for management, so they never quite match.”

Louis Navellier · 1:10:28

“newsletter touching my management material, I'm really bad.”

Louis Navellier · 1:11:05
#compliance#newsletters#asset management#regulation

Story· 2

Story13:29

The Earnings Report That Changed Navellier's Mind on Amazon

Navellier says he reversed a bearish view of Amazon after its first-quarter results surprised him. Cloud-computing profits, expanding programming ambitions, and competition with Apple gave him new evidence that the company's sales growth and business mix could justify a different judgment.

  • Navellier had focused on Amazon's losses and extreme earnings multiple.
  • The first-quarter report delivered a positive surprise.
  • Cloud computing was producing substantial profit.
  • New evidence led him to change his position rather than defend the old view.

“When I saw the first quarter results, I didn't about face first a surprise. They make a lot of money in cloud computing.”

Louis Navellier · 13:44

“they finally figured it out, and that's why I've done in about face”

Louis Navellier · 15:12
#amazon#earnings#cloud computing#valuation
Story42:56

The Failed Index Project That Launched Navellier's Career

As a student with access to Wells Fargo computers, Navellier tried to replicate the S&P 500 with 332 stocks. The portfolio failed at its intended tracking job because it beat the market, leading him to conclude that market anomalies existed and to begin documenting them in small-cap stocks.

  • The original objective was lower-cost index tracking, not outperformance.
  • A 332-stock portfolio unexpectedly beat the S&P 500.
  • Navellier treated the tracking error as evidence of anomalies.
  • He began in small caps because he considered them less efficient.

“first of all I had been building databases behind the scenes. I was fortunate to get access to mainframe computers.”

Louis Navellier · 42:56

“I knew there were an omblies on Wall Street. I could see him in small cap, and so I started in small cap, assuming that…”

Louis Navellier · 43:38
#career origin#market anomalies#small caps#index tracking

Takeaway· 4

Takeaway53:00

Why Banking Rules Made Marijuana Businesses Uninvestable

Navellier says the inability of marijuana businesses to bank their proceeds made the sector unsuitable for him at the time. He distinguishes direct operators from ancillary businesses such as LED lighting, hydroponics, or other mechanical suppliers that do not depend on handling the product's restricted cash.

  • Federal banking restrictions prevented direct businesses from depositing proceeds normally.
  • The cash constraint changed the investability of the sector.
  • Ancillary equipment providers offered a different exposure path.
  • Navellier rejected the theme unless the business sat behind the restricted transaction layer.

“No, because you can't you can't can't cash the money, can't bank.”

Louis Navellier · 53:04

“unless it's an LED lighting to make the plants grow faster, or hydroponics or some mechanical thing behind the scenes, I wouldn't invest in it”

Louis Navellier · 53:08
#marijuana#banking#regulation#ancillary businesses
Takeaway1:07:20

A Good Foreign Stock Can Still Lose to the Currency

Navellier says international investors must account for currency direction because a sound operating thesis can be overwhelmed by exchange-rate losses. His Mexican bottler and diabetes-company pairing looked economically complementary, but the peso moved against him and broke the trade.

  • A strong company thesis does not eliminate foreign-exchange exposure.
  • Business-level hedges can fail when both holdings share currency risk.
  • Commodity orientation and political events can amplify national currency moves.
  • Navellier sometimes hedges currency and treats getting it right as essential.

“when you invest internationally, you better not get the currency wrong.”

Louis Navellier · 1:07:28

“the moral of stories when you invest internationally, don't get the currency wrong.”

Louis Navellier · 1:08:45
#currency risk#international investing#hedging#emerging markets
Takeaway1:21:43

Future Investors Need Psychology and Accounting

Navellier advises aspiring finance professionals to study both crowd psychology and accounting. He views behavioral finance as the study of market crowds whose preferences can persist for months or years, while accounting supplies the fundamental literacy that benchmark-focused training can neglect.

  • Market behavior reflects crowd movement.
  • Crowd preferences can persist long enough to shape investment results.
  • Accounting remains necessary for understanding company fundamentals.
  • Benchmark-oriented finance training can underemphasize both disciplines.

“you better take a psychology class because the market is a mant of crowd”

Louis Navellier · 1:21:43

“The second thing is better taken an accounting class.”

Louis Navellier · 1:22:05
#finance careers#psychology#accounting#behavioral finance
Takeaway1:22:57

Why Stock Investors Must Watch Credit and Leverage

Navellier says the 2008 credit collapse taught him that debt-market leverage can devastate portfolios and spill into equities. He now reacts strongly to leveraged debt and keeps close contact with bond-market professionals because credit conditions reveal risks that stock analysis alone can miss.

  • Leveraged municipal funds produced severe losses despite high credit ratings.
  • Leverage magnifies gains only while the market moves in the expected direction.
  • Credit-default swaps and structured vehicles amplified the financial crisis.
  • Navellier believes strong stock investors benefit from credit-market knowledge.

“you have to read the credit markets because the credit markets influenced the stock market”

Louis Navellier · 1:23:00

“anytime I see leverage debt, I freak out.”

Louis Navellier · 1:24:15
#leverage#credit markets#financial crisis#risk